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The Beach Boys Network

Re: BBoy involvement? [Smiley Smile Message Board]

Posted: 20 Jun 2008 05:48 AM CDT

Quote from: mrski on Today at 05:14:38 AM

The Sunsets : Chug A Lug – (1963) (B. Wilson / G. Usher)

To quote the song lyrics :

"The Ivy Walls were covered with foam on Graduation night... Chug chug chug a lug..."

So despite the composer credit, a completely different song to that from the BBoys 'Surfin Safari' Lp.

Question 1 : Is this really another Wilson/Usher composition or has there been some mix up during CD compilation due to the fact that two completely different songs, (roughly connected to the 'surf genre'), have the same title...?

The correct credits for The Sunsets´ "Chug A Lug" are : Gary Usher-Mike Borchetta.

BBoy involvement? [Smiley Smile Message Board]

Posted: 20 Jun 2008 05:14 AM CDT

I floated this one out on the Shut Down board a while ago but received limited response, (courtesy of the ever dependable Mr. Stebbins.) Would be interested in what others think…

Refering to the V. Artists CD "Muscle Bustle" Ace Records CDCHD 533 :

A) The Four Speeds : Barefoot Adventure, RPM, My Sting Ray – (1962) (All G. Usher / M. Borchetta compositions.)

According to the liner notes as written by Rob Burt;

" [The Four Speeds] first session produced [the 3 tracks mentioned above]. The BBoys drummer, Dennis Wilson, appeared on all 3 tracks while Brian Wilson offfered vocal support on 'My Sting Ray".

Question 1 : Does Dennis only drum on these recordings? Anyone else think it sounds abit like him on lead vocal? (Later recorded Four Speeds tracks on this CD have a different vocalist...)

Question 2 : Has Brian's participation on 'My Sting Ray' been confirmed or is this something just in the mind of Mr Burt?

B) The Sunsets : Chug A Lug – (1963) (B. Wilson / G. Usher)

To quote the song lyrics :

"The Ivy Walls were covered with foam on Graduation night... Chug chug chug a lug..."

So despite the composer credit, a completely different song to that from the BBoys 'Surfin Safari' Lp.

Question 1 : Is this really another Wilson/Usher composition or has there been some mix up during CD compilation due to the fact that two completely different songs, (roughly connected to the 'surf genre'), have the same title...?

Re: east coast shows with Dennis Wilson mini-set...thoughts? [Smiley Smile Message Board]

Posted: 20 Jun 2008 04:22 AM CDT

Well I might play a coffeehouse for $20 on an off-day! Wink

Re: Dennis Lead Vocals On \ [Smiley Smile Message Board]

Posted: 20 Jun 2008 02:23 AM CDT

Sorry for the typo I was writing off the top of my head. A little like Dennis perhaps but I actually never thought that until you said something.

Re: Live 76-83 quality. [Smiley Smile Message Board]

Posted: 20 Jun 2008 02:21 AM CDT

Yes on youtube. Sadly it was not jetlag, even the most forgiving writers note that all three Wilson's had become full blown addicts by this time. Dennis may have had it under the most control during that time, but he was using herion, cocaine, and of course drinking on the tour. Brian and Carl as well. I like to think the best of people I admire and will defend Brian from 67-70 as still being far from an addicted hermit. Yet by 1974 he was in serious trouble and remained that way for years. It's a shame, but all too true.

Re: Live 76-83 quality. [Smiley Smile Message Board]

Posted: 20 Jun 2008 02:05 AM CDT

Quote from: MBE on Today at 01:57:24 AM

Magic_Transistor_Radio Yes Dennis is the only Wilson seeming to somewhat be with it that night.

Maybe there all just had jetlag, it was Australia and it takes a long time to get there Wink

Is any of this footage online?

Re: Live 76-83 quality. [Smiley Smile Message Board]

Posted: 20 Jun 2008 01:57 AM CDT

Quote from: Sheriff John Stone on June 19, 2008, 06:36:35 PM

MBE, I agree with all of your thoughts and opinions. The only (minor) thing I would add is something regarding the 1984-97 period.

With Dennis and Brian out of the vocal mix (not that they contributed much vocally anyway) , the guys made a conscious effort to clean up their vocals, both lead and background. I saw a few concerts during that era and you could hear/sense that they were trying to be professional, precise, and even impressive. They brought in guys like Jeff Foskett and Matt Jardine who they desperately needed. I mean, I walked away from some of those shows thinking that they at least cared what they sounded like.

I also liked the way they supplemented their sound with Richie Cannatta (spelling?), John Stamos (yes, he was an asset), David Marks (I realize it was out of necessity), and special guests like Roger McGuinn. And don't forget the cheerleaders (I hear "Pretty Woman" playing...) police

I know the 1984-97 shows were more professional, and that's why I said they pleased a mass crowd. Still I find them overall souless and I know we debated this before but I hated the cheerleaders. Why am I so hard on these shows? Well the 1993 tour, and even the longer sets Mike and Bruce do now, show that they were wasting their talent.

adamghost I think Carlin was at times rough on Carl (no offense Peter) but if it is true perhaps he felt Brian was too erratic to put front and center.

Jay I agree with you about the sets from 1977, I indicated that general opinion at the end of my paragraph about them.

Magic_Transistor_Radio Yes Dennis is the only Wilson seeming to somewhat be with it that night.

Re: east coast shows with Dennis Wilson mini-set...thoughts? [Smiley Smile Message Board]

Posted: 20 Jun 2008 01:56 AM CDT

I can't really help you (unless you want to play in a coffeehouse for $20) but as a resident of northern New Jersey, I would love if you brought the Dennis/Carl set to the area.

Re: The Zombies - Odessey and Oracle [Smiley Smile Message Board]

Posted: 20 Jun 2008 01:52 AM CDT

You would probably enjoy the following:
The Rascals - Once Upon A Dream
Van Dyke Parks - Song Cycle
Great Speckled Bird - S/T
The Association - And then...along comes The Association
The Millennium - Begin
Margo Guryan - Take A Picture
Os Mutantes - S/T
The Moon - Without Earth & S/T
Harpers Bizarre - Secret Life Of... & 4
Harry Nilsson - The Point! & Schmilsson
..and if you like the over the top orchestrated British thing, these are definitely recommended:
Electric Light Orchestra - El Dorado
Billy Nicholls - Would You Believe
Small Faces - Ogden's Nut Gone Flake
Pretty Things - SF Sorrow
Traffic - Dear Mr. Fantasy

....Who - Sell Out and Guess Who - Canned Wheat are also both top notch. Kinks - Village Green is great too, as is Arthur, or The Decline of the British Empire. But yeah, pretty random list, but those are all fairly rad psychedelic concept albums with cool vocal work and orchestration (and trippy sounds)

Common from Bambu disc [Smiley Smile Message Board]

Posted: 20 Jun 2008 12:11 AM CDT

I was listening to this instrumental track and in the later part of the song, it sounded very familiar to me. It was driving me nuts. I actually started thinking maybe it was Manheim Steemroller or something. Razz

Then it hit me. It is in Holy Evening!

Re: thoughts of you [Smiley Smile Message Board]

Posted: 19 Jun 2008 11:59 PM CDT

Dennis.

Re: Why POB/Bambu is important ... [Smiley Smile Message Board]

Posted: 19 Jun 2008 11:58 PM CDT

Its ironic, that niether the follow up to PS or POB were ever finished! There was enough done to justify a great release and even improvement over their predicesors. And the composers each began a back slide afterwards.

Perhaps it is suicidal to make a heart felt album of emotion!

Re: Live 76-83 quality. [Smiley Smile Message Board]

Posted: 19 Jun 2008 11:36 PM CDT

I saw a video of the BBs in 77 or 78 in the Australia tour when Carl was on something. I believe they were doing a show for tv and Carl started ranting about POB. Dennis joked that Carl got his for free. Carl then said 'That's merda do touro; Dennis looked offended (probably jokingly). Carl then looks to stage left and yell 'shut up Billy!" Dennis then whispers something to Carl, before Dennis calmly introduces Surfer Girl (?).

I find this very odd, in that Dennis is the most sobre Wilson on the stage! It almost seemed like Dennis was a bit embarrassed by Carl and whispered for him to shut up. Although, from what I know about Dennis, I find that highly unlikely.

Re: Live 76-83 quality. [Smiley Smile Message Board]

Posted: 19 Jun 2008 10:35 PM CDT

Quote from: MBE on June 19, 2008, 04:46:14 PM

I would like to post my thoughts on this era.
The Beach Boys in the summer of 1976 seem to be playing a lot of oldies, but they are taking them seriously. There also was a lot of rare songs still played and some great music from their band. Dennis is still in good shape and so is Carl.

Yet by the end of the year Brian is back and while he could sometimes be fun, his live appearances over the next six years are largely off key and off kilter. Also by the end of 1976/ early 77 Carl and Dennis are not performing at their best. Dennis' looks are going downhill, and along with Carl is more often then not stoned or drunk on stage. It continued this way through 1978 but the shows still had some artistic things to offer. Afterall they were still fairly young and the music hadn't completely lost it's freshness. Charles Lloyd added a lot to the group at the time, and Mike and Al seemed to be in very good voice for the most part.

1979-1980 was both better and worse. Bruce was back for good but he only added to the oldies vibe that was wearing thin. Dennis was gone half the time and was in mediocre shape when he was there. He still could add something fun to the shows as the Knebworth DVD shows, but he was becoming an embarrassment in some ways. Still Carl was back in top shape and sometimes (such as the 7-4-80 show) could really spark the band to life. Brian however was far worse then he had been, now he just sat at the piano barely addressing the audience. Sometimes it's doubtful that he was plugged in. Before he hadoften played the bass for half the show and talked to the crowd. The songlist was ok with a lot of new material, but with Lloyd and Carli gone the show seemed a bit more bland.

When Carl left in 1981 the show fell apart with no one performing very well. Brian and Dennis had sunk so low that you felt sorry for them, and the set added some really age inappropriate songs and took out much of the more challenging material. Brian was forced to be more of a presence but his voice was in horrible shape and his weird dancing during a few numbers was very sad in his now obese condition. A bad time.

From mid 82-83 Dennis is often not there which is for perhaps the best as nobody could now ignore where he was at. Brian got better in 1983 and through the spring of 1984 (when he stopped touring with the group regularly) actually seemed to be having fun. He did some new songs, and while still not in great voice he was far more alert then he would ever be again. The shows were better overall by mid 1982 because Carl was back, and he had them do some good material and insisted they play with more enthusiasm. The sets weren't perfect as the car medley was still there but Carl's revisions seemed to last until Dennis' death.

With Brian gone by the middle of 1984, Carl settled back and with the exception of some of the summer of 1988 shows, and the box set tour in 1993, they never again reached pre 1981 levels. In fact for most of 84-97 they were detracting from their legacy while pleasing a less discerning crowd. Thankfully the solo shows since 1998 have been largely respectable. I wouldn't directly compare them to the group in it's pre 1974 prime, but even Mike and Bruce in the last six or seven years have improved their show to where the horror of their late 90's shows can be almost forgotten.

I agree with most of what you said, but I see the 1977-78 era as being great as far as the setlist was concerned. A good portion of 15BO and Love You were being performed. Sure, "Airplane" isn't anything close to "God Only Knows" for example, but in my opinion it's far more interesting than "Be True To Your School". I think "Roller Skating Child" was one of their best concert numbers from that period. Plus, they were doing "All This Is That" and "Feel Flows" back to back, which I would have sold my mother to see. Grin

east coast shows with Dennis Wilson mini-set...thoughts? [Smiley Smile Message Board]

Posted: 19 Jun 2008 10:12 PM CDT

I'm in the middle of booking a national tour that's going to run from July through mid-September. I hadn't posted about it here because, besides probably a Wilson tune in the middle of the set, it's primarily to promote my own music and I've already taken up too much Smiley Smile bandwidth with that. I had thought until today that it was going to be mostly solo, or with pick-up musicians, but now it looks like it might be possible to get my whole band to the east coast for a brief period provided we can get enough work to pay the air fares. This would be at the tail end of August.

So here's what I wanted to put out there. If I could find a gig or two that would pay well enough, I'd be willing to stage part of the Dennis and Carl Wilson set as part of it. We wouldn't be able to do the entire show, and we wouldn't be able to do more than one or two dates, but that would be enough to justify bringing the band out. It would have to be somewhere in the northeast...NYC, Boston, Philly, in that general area, to coincide with shows we already have booked.

I don't know if anyone has access to a promoter that could do the guarantee or would be interested in taking this on themselves. It's really just an idea I had as I'm trying to figure out how to get my crew across the country, so I'm posting about it. This is really just thinking out loud.

Incidentally, if anyone would like to help out with any other part of the tour, or wants more information on it, I would welcome that. It is going to hit most of the U.S. Some of the dates are posted at my myspace page: www.myspace.com/adammarsland. My e-mail is adamghost@aol.com if anyone has any ideas.

Re: Live 76-83 quality. [Smiley Smile Message Board]

Posted: 19 Jun 2008 10:04 PM CDT

I've seen video from '78 and Brian is THE BASS PLAYER. I mean literally, he's playing the whole show, not singing a whole lot, just being in the band, and what's more he's running all over the stage like he's having a blast. When I saw this I was shocked.

The Carlin book indicates the Carl dictated that Brian not play bass and stick to the piano, and that Brian really wanted to play the bass. I found this surprising and I don't know if it's accurate, but the difference between the footage at the concerts where's he playing bass and sitting bored behind the piano is really striking. It could just be the mood he was in that night, of course.

Re: Why POB/Bambu is important ... [Smiley Smile Message Board]

Posted: 19 Jun 2008 10:01 PM CDT

I think this is a great point.

When I got interviewed about the album (hasn't come out yet, but hopefully it will because it was a big paper) I made the point that it was probably too difficult for Brian after PET SOUNDS to really confront his feelings and put them out there on vinyl. He really veers away from emotional expression after that point (as opposed to making observations about his day to day life), I can only think of a few examples: "Til I Die," "It's Not Easy Being Me," "Still I Dream Of It," maybe "My Diane" if you stretch a point.

Dennis, as per character, was the fearless one. He dived in to the pool of his emotions, and he picked up that baton and ran with it. And you could argue it cost him his life. It's hard to live your life with your nerves exposed like that.